Comments on: Characters Without Goals and Novels With Bad-Guy Gods

By: Patrick

Patrick — Wed, 11 Aug 2010 01:06:41 +0000

I found this post fascinating, and like the specific breaking down of the Storyworld God and demigods.

Also, the information on Story goals is something I need to think on to improve my one sentence summaries!

By: Carrie Neuman

Carrie Neuman — Wed, 11 Aug 2010 10:38:59 +0000

Thanks for the reminder of the Storygoal as a seperate thing, Randy. In my current outline, I know my protag is looking for respect and he thinks he’ll get it by getting rich. But at its simplest, he’s trying to stop the evil mamluk from setting him up as a patsy in order to gain control of Aswan.

Working on my one-sentence summary was making me crazy! That was just what I needed.

By: Elizabeth Rudolph

Elizabeth Rudolph — Wed, 11 Aug 2010 12:58:03 +0000

Katy don’t worry about offend a group of people like Randy said. I’ve read many books just because they are different and someone said they are offending. If your books gets to publication after you write it I would definitely buy it. Just because its different.

By: Gayle Messick

Gayle Messick — Wed, 11 Aug 2010 13:52:33 +0000

I think trying to get an emotional reaction out of readers is what we want. I think it is better to write something that causes some people to get angry and quit reading then have a tepid response or none at all. Posting chapters at a forum has proven this to me. When I posted less tension chapters (which is stupid I know now) the response was almost nonexistent. I posted a chapter that caused so much anxiety on the readers, the comment thread not only grew but people started defending their own interpretations and not in simple sentences but by paragraphs and capitalized letters and pleadings. lol I loved it. I also implored the scene/sequel method for the first time and made sure I used motivation-reaction units. I introduce the actual story question (Will she or won’t she allow herself to be seduced by her husband rival?) The readers are up in arms. Yea! We will see if the next post has caused my readership to fallen or enlarged (due to word of mouth).

Thank you.

By: Lois Hudson

Lois Hudson — Wed, 11 Aug 2010 21:31:22 +0000

Gee, Randy, you’d better watch out. You’ll be having some preacher-types banning your blog for advocating the creation of your own god, demi- tho she might be!

By: Katy

Katy — Thu, 12 Aug 2010 07:17:54 +0000

Thanks so much for answering my questions Randy! You’ve definitely given me a lot to thing about and helped me make a few decisions. (And thanks so everyone who commented too!)

I know quite a few writers have trouble with their story questions or story goals from other blogs, etc. that I read. And I’m starting to think it has a lot to do with the complexity of the story. I don’t think that a complex book is any better or worse then a non-complex one (though I’d be interested to know what you thought Randy), but there certainly is that difference between a linear sort of story, for example the character swears in the first chapter to track down their fathers killer and proceeds throughout to do just that, and a more convaluted one, in which a character has to grow and learn and pass through many different scenes and even places just to work out where they want to go (think Lord Of The Rings). In this case there are so many separate personal character goals, that the story goal, or story question can be hard to define.

In the past when I’ve written I haven’t had this story question problem, I’ve always just instinctively known it, but perhaps they were more linear stories. After reading your reply to my question I took a long, hard, very distant look at my novel and I’ve finally been able to place the question that everything is mounting too, “Can they stop the war?” I’m excited that now I can shape my novel to more effectively answer this question.

I’ve also decided to take your advice and seriously amp up the whole God, or demi-God I suppose, conflict. I think this’ll that the plot a lot deeper. As for a storyworld God being the bad guy it certainly is an interesting idea! I’m not sure how you’d do it, but I’d love to try! I guess I’ll have to credit you for that one though

Thanks again Randy, you’ve really been a big help!

By: Charlotte Babb

Charlotte Babb — Thu, 12 Aug 2010 09:55:42 +0000

Thanks for expressing the will she/won’t she phrase of the story goal. I’ve had problems with that too. I’m not sure that my first novel had a strong enough story goal, but I can certainly work on the next one.

By: KC

KC — Thu, 12 Aug 2010 18:12:50 +0000

In my first novel, my female protag didn’t want anything UNTIL something happened to her that made her angry, bitter, etc. She finds God in the process of working through these roadblocks in her life. Not sure if that’s strong enough as far as goal–I’m not sure what my yes/no question would be. Perhaps that’s why I think the novel is weak.

By: Koos

Koos — Fri, 13 Aug 2010 14:14:07 +0000

Perhaps it is safer to either keep God out of the writing, or keep to the Biblical view (though that will upset a lot of religions who wish Him to fit their view). I type this from a Christian perspective, keeping in mind that mankind has a way of wishing to apply any fiction to reality as they deem fit.

And it might be dangerous for the writer if another was to say they were led astray by someone’s writing. After all, since the Beginning, people loved blaming another.

By: Jake

Jake — Fri, 13 Aug 2010 18:08:21 +0000

From what I’ve read here, I’m not sure if you planning on portraying a god (small-g) or God (big-G). It’s one thing to portray a god as evil. It’s quite another to portray God as evil.

The first isn’t necessarily a problem because a “god” is not “God”. The second will sell more books at the cost of committing blasphemy.

Now, Randy is right, “God” in your story world isn’t “God” in the real world. But all your readers are in the real world, and their view of “God” in the real world will be shaped by “God” in your story world (some more than others).

Consider the Chronicles of Narnia. I would say that many readers have a greater sense of God’s awesome presence and amazing love because of Aslan. But what if C.S. Lewis made Aslan evil? How would reader’s perspectives of the real-world God have changed?