Comments on: How To Confuse Your Reader http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/ America's Mad Professor of Fiction Writing Wed, 16 May 2012 17:13:29 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.1.3 By: Adam http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-11202 Adam Sat, 31 Jul 2010 02:16:00 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-11202 THANK you. I needed to hear this. While I've generally gotten over the Tom Swifties and the hesitance to use "said" each time a character talks, I keep trying to avoid repeating a character's name too often in prose. When I see it in other people's works I tend to cringe a bit but always thought they were just doing it wrong, not that it shouldn't be done. Now I know better. THANK you. I needed to hear this. While I’ve generally gotten over the Tom Swifties and the hesitance to use “said” each time a character talks, I keep trying to avoid repeating a character’s name too often in prose. When I see it in other people’s works I tend to cringe a bit but always thought they were just doing it wrong, not that it shouldn’t be done. Now I know better.

]]> By: Judith Robl http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-11210 Judith Robl Sat, 31 Jul 2010 11:00:47 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-11210 Name switches are not the only way to confuse the reader. I just read a proposal for a publisher in which short scenes changed as quickly as strobe lights - without concrete reference to ground the reader. Are there specific techniques you can recommend to keep us from doing that kind of thing? Name switches are not the only way to confuse the reader.

I just read a proposal for a publisher in which short scenes changed as quickly as strobe lights - without concrete reference to ground the reader.

Are there specific techniques you can recommend to keep us from doing that kind of thing?

]]> By: Sakhi http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-11217 Sakhi Sat, 31 Jul 2010 15:29:48 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-11217 I have a question related to this. In WIP, characters go by titles because their true names give people power on them. In one of the characters, this is significant, because when she thinks about herself I have her true name, but other characters think and talk about her with title. How do I make it clear that I'm using the two names interchangeably? I have a question related to this. In WIP, characters go by titles because their true names give people power on them. In one of the characters, this is significant, because when she thinks about herself I have her true name, but other characters think and talk about her with title. How do I make it clear that I’m using the two names interchangeably?

]]> By: Levi Montgomery http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-11220 Levi Montgomery Sat, 31 Jul 2010 17:43:11 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-11220 One thing you didn't mention is the effect of point of view on names. In any story which utilizes more than one point of view, there's a strong possibility that names will have to switch as POV switches. When you're following an adult through his workday, in third person, you might call him Doe, but when you switch to his wife, looking out the window, hoping he'll park on the far side of her car so he doesn't see the dent, he's going to be John, and in most families, his nine-year-old daughter is going to be watching for Dad or Daddy. Granted, if you try to use all of those names in one scene, you're probably not close enough to the POV character, and it's going to confuse the reader as much as it confuses you. It's up to you, as the author, to make this all clear, and personally, I think that if the characters aren't alive enough in your head to carry all the names they need, then it's probably too soon to try to tell that story. Let it steep a while longer. Let those characters begin to breathe and live on their own. When they're ready, you're not going to have any trouble telling them apart. We have dozens of names and titles in real life, and in the stories we write, conveying that depth of life shouldn't be a problem. Levi One thing you didn’t mention is the effect of point of view on names. In any story which utilizes more than one point of view, there’s a strong possibility that names will have to switch as POV switches. When you’re following an adult through his workday, in third person, you might call him Doe, but when you switch to his wife, looking out the window, hoping he’ll park on the far side of her car so he doesn’t see the dent, he’s going to be John, and in most families, his nine-year-old daughter is going to be watching for Dad or Daddy.

Granted, if you try to use all of those names in one scene, you’re probably not close enough to the POV character, and it’s going to confuse the reader as much as it confuses you.

It’s up to you, as the author, to make this all clear, and personally, I think that if the characters aren’t alive enough in your head to carry all the names they need, then it’s probably too soon to try to tell that story. Let it steep a while longer. Let those characters begin to breathe and live on their own. When they’re ready, you’re not going to have any trouble telling them apart.

We have dozens of names and titles in real life, and in the stories we write, conveying that depth of life shouldn’t be a problem.

Levi

]]> By: Tami Meyers http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-11249 Tami Meyers Mon, 02 Aug 2010 05:12:05 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-11249 Hi Randy, In my WIP set in the 1850's gold rush one of the main characters is Chinese. His name is Hing Sung Ti (pronounced Heng Soong Tee) I don't know which of the names would be most commonly used by others so I've been using all three. Does anyone have any suggestions? I know that Hing would be his family (last) name, but what would others call him? Hi Randy, In my WIP set in the 1850’s gold rush one of the main characters is Chinese. His name is Hing Sung Ti (pronounced Heng Soong Tee) I don’t know which of the names would be most commonly used by others so I’ve been using all three. Does anyone have any suggestions? I know that Hing would be his family (last) name, but what would others call him?

]]> By: Luke http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-11256 Luke Mon, 02 Aug 2010 11:36:52 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-11256 I think Levi answered this pretty well with his "it depends on who's doing the talking". So, I would answer the following questions: What do his different family members call him? - wife would probably say Sung Ti - his children would be baba (if you want to use the Chinese) or father (if you want to use the English). What would his friends call him? - Probably Sung Ti in an informal setting. - If they are at work and equals, probably Sung Ti - If they are at work and not equals, then probably Mr. Hing What about others? Here's where you decide. It depends on how they feel about him. Do they follow Chinese traditions of respect? Does Sung Ti have a preference? Do they like him? Would they use a racial slur (Chinaman would be period appropriate)? In terms of what you should call him, I would say in a given scene use whatever your POV character would call him. I think Levi answered this pretty well with his “it depends on who’s doing the talking”. So, I would answer the following questions:

What do his different family members call him?
- wife would probably say Sung Ti
- his children would be baba (if you want to use the Chinese) or father (if you want to use the English).

What would his friends call him?
- Probably Sung Ti in an informal setting.
- If they are at work and equals, probably Sung Ti
- If they are at work and not equals, then probably Mr. Hing

What about others? Here’s where you decide. It depends on how they feel about him. Do they follow Chinese traditions of respect? Does Sung Ti have a preference? Do they like him? Would they use a racial slur (Chinaman would be period appropriate)?

In terms of what you should call him, I would say in a given scene use whatever your POV character would call him.

]]> By: Tammy http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-11262 Tammy Mon, 02 Aug 2010 15:55:07 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-11262 I am the total opposite. I keep using the names over and over along with "X saw this" and "X did that", "He measured - He jumped - He landed". I also worry that I've used the characters name too many times in a page of writing, starting each new paragraph with some for of What X is doing in this chunk of text. I've been looking critically through some of my favorite books for what those writers are doing. It seems that there is no way to avoid this naming, and it occurs frequently in books that I love. Also, as a reader, I don’t recall reading all the names in sentences; I just remember what was going on. So perhaps this is just how its done. If the story is compelling, then the names seem natural? I am the total opposite. I keep using the names over and over along with “X saw this” and “X did that”, “He measured - He jumped - He landed”. I also worry that I’ve used the characters name too many times in a page of writing, starting each new paragraph with some for of What X is doing in this chunk of text.

I’ve been looking critically through some of my favorite books for what those writers are doing. It seems that there is no way to avoid this naming, and it occurs frequently in books that I love.

Also, as a reader, I don’t recall reading all the names in sentences; I just remember what was going on. So perhaps this is just how its done. If the story is compelling, then the names seem natural?

]]> By: Luke http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-11265 Luke Mon, 02 Aug 2010 17:37:36 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-11265 I think that's absolutely true. We're always looking to eliminate repetitive words, but there are some words that are just "white space" words. No one counts the number of words like "the","and", etc... unless there's just a ridiculous number of them. A person's name, so long as you're not using 50 times per page is not noticable. 5-10 times and it just seems normal. Or at the very least doesn't call attention to itself. I think that’s absolutely true. We’re always looking to eliminate repetitive words, but there are some words that are just “white space” words. No one counts the number of words like “the”,”and”, etc… unless there’s just a ridiculous number of them.

A person’s name, so long as you’re not using 50 times per page is not noticable. 5-10 times and it just seems normal. Or at the very least doesn’t call attention to itself.

]]> By: Jessica Thomas http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-11274 Jessica Thomas Tue, 03 Aug 2010 02:04:09 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-11274 Another related tip I've either learned or read about along the way is, when naming your characters, start with different letters of the alphabet. Don't have a slew of characters with "s" names. Sam, Sherri, Stuart, Sally. I've confused myself in my own writing and had to do some renaming. Another related tip I’ve either learned or read about along the way is, when naming your characters, start with different letters of the alphabet. Don’t have a slew of characters with “s” names. Sam, Sherri, Stuart, Sally. I’ve confused myself in my own writing and had to do some renaming.

]]> By: Mohamed Mughal http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-11282 Mohamed Mughal Tue, 03 Aug 2010 12:14:51 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-11282 I agree with you with one minor exception: if there's a utility or contextual reason for the name change. For example, I might have a soldier in my story. All along he's called "Bates." In a scene with his mother, he's called "Johnny." Interesting post; interesting blog. I'll be back :) I agree with you with one minor exception: if there’s a utility or contextual reason for the name change. For example, I might have a soldier in my story. All along he’s called “Bates.” In a scene with his mother, he’s called “Johnny.”

Interesting post; interesting blog. I’ll be back :)

]]> By: Angela Breidenbach http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-11289 Angela Breidenbach Tue, 03 Aug 2010 20:06:15 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-11289 Sometimes I want to use a nickname to show a different relationship. But I remember driving my critique partners nuts when I switched it too often :-) Angie Sometimes I want to use a nickname to show a different relationship. But I remember driving my critique partners nuts when I switched it too often :-)
Angie

]]> By: Mira http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-14350 Mira Sat, 23 Oct 2010 20:39:56 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2010/07/30/how-to-confuse-your-reader/#comment-14350 @Tami Meyers I'm only part Chinese but I thought I'd offer what I know. In Chinese culture, you can only call someone by first name if you're on friendly terms. For example, imagine two girls who meet in class on the first day of school. They'd start off by using one another's family name, then gradually as they become closer and on more friendly terms, they'd sooner or later decided it's time to drop the formality. This usually occurs in the form of an invitation, one would casually say something along the lines of 'just call me [insert first name] from now on.' It might seem a little awkward at first but it would become more natural over time, to the point where their initial formality would be all but forgotten. Another example, if you call someone you've just met by first name, unless that person is incredibly laid-back and easygoing, and has zero interest in cultural norms, that can be insulting...it could be taken as something like 'familiarity breeds contempt' I guess. In this case, the polite thing to do would be to use the complete name, so surname/family name first, followed by the first/given name. It's also fine to use just the family name, when speaking to a male or a female. Hope that helped out a little, best wishes. @Tami Meyers
I’m only part Chinese but I thought I’d offer what I know. In Chinese culture, you can only call someone by first name if you’re on friendly terms. For example, imagine two girls who meet in class on the first day of school. They’d start off by using one another’s family name, then gradually as they become closer and on more friendly terms, they’d sooner or later decided it’s time to drop the formality. This usually occurs in the form of an invitation, one would casually say something along the lines of ‘just call me [insert first name] from now on.’ It might seem a little awkward at first but it would become more natural over time, to the point where their initial formality would be all but forgotten.

Another example, if you call someone you’ve just met by first name, unless that person is incredibly laid-back and easygoing, and has zero interest in cultural norms, that can be insulting…it could be taken as something like ‘familiarity breeds contempt’ I guess. In this case, the polite thing to do would be to use the complete name, so surname/family name first, followed by the first/given name. It’s also fine to use just the family name, when speaking to a male or a female. Hope that helped out a little, best wishes.

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