Comments on: Sam The Plumber On “Preaching to the Choir” http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/ America's Mad Professor of Fiction Writing Wed, 08 Feb 2012 19:09:49 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.1.3 By: Edwina Cowgill http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7925 Edwina Cowgill Sat, 08 Aug 2009 15:06:44 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7925 Excellent article! I loved the humor and yet Sam hit the nail on its head. When we give people what WE think they want, rather than what THEY want, not only are we not going to sell books, I think we have insulted their intelligence. We must know our readers - who is our market - and sell to them. Thanks for sharing this article! Edwina Cowgill www.musingsofedwina.blogspot.com Excellent article! I loved the humor and yet Sam hit the nail on its head. When we give people what WE think they want, rather than what THEY want, not only are we not going to sell books, I think we have insulted their intelligence. We must know our readers - who is our market - and sell to them.

Thanks for sharing this article!

Edwina Cowgill
www.musingsofedwina.blogspot.com

]]> By: Davalynn http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7926 Davalynn Sat, 08 Aug 2009 15:33:06 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7926 It's amazing, and somehow encouraging, to hear that you are in the midst of revision with your editors - you who write so well and are teaching so many of us how to write well. It's simply evidence that you practice what you preach. Thanks for taking us along on your ride and giving us a glimpse of the inside workings! It’s amazing, and somehow encouraging, to hear that you are in the midst of revision with your editors - you who write so well and are teaching so many of us how to write well. It’s simply evidence that you practice what you preach. Thanks for taking us along on your ride and giving us a glimpse of the inside workings!

]]> By: Donald James Parker http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7927 Donald James Parker Sat, 08 Aug 2009 15:54:01 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7927 Entertaining story, as always when Sam stops by to interrupt a good day. Those one star reviews are irritating and usually extremely biased or completely irrational. I take them with a whole salt shaker since a grain won't suffice. If I read a good Christian novel which preaches to the choir, I'll usually give it a four. One possessing the same quality but preaches to the world will get a five. Success in sales does not equate with ultimate worth of a book. Ultimately, just as with humans, God is the judge of the value of all human endeavor. If he gives me a five star review, I couldn't care less about how many stars are lit up on Amazon. You're right about the choir though. There are no doubt some members of the group who need the preaching. Thee are two facets to faith, finding it and walking in it. Fiction can help Christians walk in our faith. Donald James Parker Author of Love Waits Entertaining story, as always when Sam stops by to interrupt a good day. Those one star reviews are irritating and usually extremely biased or completely irrational. I take them with a whole salt shaker since a grain won’t suffice. If I read a good Christian novel which preaches to the choir, I’ll usually give it a four. One possessing the same quality but preaches to the world will get a five. Success in sales does not equate with ultimate worth of a book. Ultimately, just as with humans, God is the judge of the value of all human endeavor. If he gives me a five star review, I couldn’t care less about how many stars are lit up on Amazon.
You’re right about the choir though. There are no doubt some members of the group who need the preaching. Thee are two facets to faith, finding it and walking in it. Fiction can help Christians walk in our faith.
Donald James Parker
Author of Love Waits

]]> By: Nicole http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7928 Nicole Sat, 08 Aug 2009 16:54:20 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7928 Bravo, Randy--er, Sam. The bottom line is to write the story God has given us to tell. Amen to the five star reviews from the Lord. We forget who we're born to honor, please, and, well, work for, not to mention be obedient to. Yes, I ended with a lot of prepositions. Oh well. Bravo, Randy–er, Sam.

The bottom line is to write the story God has given us to tell. Amen to the five star reviews from the Lord. We forget who we’re born to honor, please, and, well, work for, not to mention be obedient to. Yes, I ended with a lot of prepositions. Oh well.

]]> By: Andra M. http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7929 Andra M. Sat, 08 Aug 2009 21:42:31 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7929 On a writing review website I received a one-star review. It hurt at first, but then I decided to see it as a badge of honor. One stars can show our writing wiggled underneath the reader's skin. It's one of those precious emotional reactions all writers seek. For instance, I wrote a novella, and gave a copy to my mom. A few days ago she told me she couldn't finish it because the protagonist was gay. My reaction? Good! It means the idea made her cringe a little, which was one intent of the story. Sometimes we should make our audience squirm. On a writing review website I received a one-star review. It hurt at first, but then I decided to see it as a badge of honor.

One stars can show our writing wiggled underneath the reader’s skin. It’s one of those precious emotional reactions all writers seek.

For instance, I wrote a novella, and gave a copy to my mom. A few days ago she told me she couldn’t finish it because the protagonist was gay.

My reaction? Good! It means the idea made her cringe a little, which was one intent of the story.

Sometimes we should make our audience squirm.

]]> By: Sheila Deeth http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7930 Sheila Deeth Sat, 08 Aug 2009 22:42:01 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7930 I love it whenever Sam puts in an appearance. But why do I keep reading things that remind me to wonder who I'm writing for and why? Is there a message somewhere? Perhaps I should call a plumber. I love it whenever Sam puts in an appearance. But why do I keep reading things that remind me to wonder who I’m writing for and why? Is there a message somewhere? Perhaps I should call a plumber.

]]> By: Emily Cotton http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7932 Emily Cotton Sun, 09 Aug 2009 03:25:32 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7932 I enjoyed Sam's viewpoint, Randy. But then I've never subscribed much to the idea that one book is what changes a person's life. Change is incremental -- things reach a tipping point, and then the changee claims that the last item is what did it. There's only so much a storybook can do, and if it doesn't start by doing what it's supposed to do -- tell a story the reader wants to know -- then it won't get far enough to do even a tiny bit of anything else. My one question for the writers who don't want to 'preach to the choir' (myself included) have any idea what tune those they want to reach outside this proverbial choir want to sing? Good to think about. I enjoyed Sam’s viewpoint, Randy. But then I’ve never subscribed much to the idea that one book is what changes a person’s life. Change is incremental — things reach a tipping point, and then the changee claims that the last item is what did it. There’s only so much a storybook can do, and if it doesn’t start by doing what it’s supposed to do — tell a story the reader wants to know — then it won’t get far enough to do even a tiny bit of anything else.

My one question for the writers who don’t want to ‘preach to the choir’ (myself included) have any idea what tune those they want to reach outside this proverbial choir want to sing?

Good to think about.

]]> By: Gumbo Writers http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7939 Gumbo Writers Mon, 10 Aug 2009 20:33:57 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7939 Just checking out your website for the first time. Really a pleasure to read and you have some great resources and advice here. Thanks. Just checking out your website for the first time. Really a pleasure to read and you have some great resources and advice here. Thanks.

]]> By: Hannah L. http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7947 Hannah L. Tue, 18 Aug 2009 14:49:25 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7947 Sam always manages to light up my day and remind me of important truths at the same time. Gotta love 'im. ~Hannah Sam always manages to light up my day and remind me of important truths at the same time. Gotta love ‘im.

~Hannah

]]> By: Tracy B. http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7948 Tracy B. Tue, 18 Aug 2009 20:51:29 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7948 Ok, I'm not sure where these comments should go (1st time blogging), nor am I sure whether or not this question has been asked: 1) In your "Writing the Perfect Scene" article, you talk about Scenes, Sequels and MRUs (or whatever you wish to call them), and they make sense for character interaction. However, I was wondering were descriptive "scenes" fit into the story structure? In other words, you are describing what a person looks like, how the office is set up, etc. These aren't "Scenes" as there is no goal/conflict/disaster, nor a "Sequel" as there is no reaction/dilemma/decision. (And before you ask, no I have not gotten hold of Swain's book yet, and yes I realize that Scenes/Sequels/etc can/should span paragraphs.) 2)I'm also having difficulty with Step 3 of the Snowflake Method, specifically in regards to motivation and goal. I have some character I have been working with for many years and I know their history and personality, etc, but they're not talking to me about motivations and goals (teenagers....). And can/do motivations/goals/conflicts/epiphanies change as the story does (original conflict leads to original epiphany that leads to bigger conflict and another epiphany, etc. or character starts off with one goal then changes/is forced into another goal, etc.) For example: you have a character whose sole motivation/goal is to lie on the beach in Hawaii. Then s/he learns the beach is threatened, so s/he sets out to save the beach, only to learn later on that it is not just the beach, but the entire planet that's threatened (and that's the storyline of the book). So, when writing Step 3, is the motivation/goal "lying on a beach" or "save the world" or both in sequence? Ok, I’m not sure where these comments should go (1st time blogging), nor am I sure whether or not this question has been asked:

1) In your “Writing the Perfect Scene” article, you talk about Scenes, Sequels and MRUs (or whatever you wish to call them), and they make sense for character interaction. However, I was wondering were descriptive “scenes” fit into the story structure? In other words, you are describing what a person looks like, how the office is set up, etc. These aren’t “Scenes” as there is no goal/conflict/disaster, nor a “Sequel” as there is no reaction/dilemma/decision. (And before you ask, no I have not gotten hold of Swain’s book yet, and yes I realize that Scenes/Sequels/etc can/should span paragraphs.)

2)I’m also having difficulty with Step 3 of the Snowflake Method, specifically in regards to motivation and goal. I have some character I have been working with for many years and I know their history and personality, etc, but they’re not talking to me about motivations and goals (teenagers….). And can/do motivations/goals/conflicts/epiphanies change as the story does (original conflict leads to original epiphany that leads to bigger conflict and another epiphany, etc. or character starts off with one goal then changes/is forced into another goal, etc.)

For example: you have a character whose sole motivation/goal is to lie on the beach in Hawaii. Then s/he learns the beach is threatened, so s/he sets out to save the beach, only to learn later on that it is not just the beach, but the entire planet that’s threatened (and that’s the storyline of the book). So, when writing Step 3, is the motivation/goal “lying on a beach” or “save the world” or both in sequence?

]]> By: Marie http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7953 Marie Fri, 21 Aug 2009 19:08:02 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7953 I love Sam. Wish I had him or someone like him in my life. Thanks. I love Sam. Wish I had him or someone like him in my life. Thanks.

]]> By: JohanV http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7959 JohanV Sun, 23 Aug 2009 17:23:56 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7959 While we're not really discussing any topic what do you all think of this... One-sentence summery: a Successful doctor is forced to kill his daughter in order to save his son. While we’re not really discussing any topic what do you all think of this…

One-sentence summery:

a Successful doctor is forced to kill his daughter in order to save his son.

]]> By: JohanV http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7960 JohanV Sun, 23 Aug 2009 17:40:55 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7960 Or even the kick in the teeth technique... a Respected doctor's only chance to save his son is to kill his daughter. What do you think? Or even the kick in the teeth technique…

a Respected doctor’s only chance to save his son is to kill his daughter.

What do you think?

]]> By: Pam Halter http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7968 Pam Halter Mon, 07 Sep 2009 14:00:57 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7968 Fingernail polish will dissolve Super Glue. But Sam is right. Our book will never be finished if we don't sit ourselves down and get it done. Self discipline ~ so easy to plan ~ so hard to do. Now, where is MY Butt Glue? Fingernail polish will dissolve Super Glue.

But Sam is right. Our book will never be finished if we don’t sit ourselves down and get it done. Self discipline ~ so easy to plan ~ so hard to do.

Now, where is MY Butt Glue?

]]> By: Faith http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7971 Faith Sat, 12 Sep 2009 17:56:01 +0000 http://www.advancedfictionwriting.com/blog/2009/08/07/sam-the-plumber-on-preaching-to-the-choir/#comment-7971 Delightful story and a very clear message. I've been trying to find some "butt glue" that works. Unlike Sam, the people around me seem to be the solvent. Delightful story and a very clear message. I’ve been trying to find some “butt glue” that works. Unlike Sam, the people around me seem to be the solvent.

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